[Rejected] ttt_67thway_v7(_j_l) Suggestion

[Mitchel256]

• Full map name
  ttt_67thway_v7(_j_l)
• Type of map
  Gmod - TTT
• Link to map download
  https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=140410125
• Additional information
  The first of many upcoming map submissions to the TTT server! And this one's first for a reason. Welcome to ttt_67thway_v7, which should easily be considered the definitive version of 67th pre-modernization, and one of the mainstays of every good TTT maplist.
  
  67thway, even back in 2013, when this version was posted, had everything a TTT map needs. As far as map design, there are wide-open areas for players to congregate, goof around, and accuse each other, as well as for snipers to pick off the less aware. There are narrow corridors to isolate and silence the curious and/or wary wanderers. There are attractions, such as the T-Tester, gun store, and barn to draw players away from the crowds (or into them), as well as T-specific utilities and rooms to give Traitors the edge they need when picking off numerous Innocents.
  
  The only mark against this particular version (though, it's a plus to some) is the absence of the cars driving down the main street. The hilarity inherent in having blind, deaf, and stupid motorists blazing through a high-traffic area of the map is not present, though neither is the off-chance of being in the middle of a big play and accidentally forgetting to watch out of murderous Sunday Drivers.
  
  The map strikes a balance of having important Traitor utilities focused in one place, near the T-Tester, giving the mobility and surprises they need. However, unlike previous versions of the map, some tried-and-true traps that can be used in the basement can now be circumVENTed by the addition of a vent system that requires Innos to destroy their best hope: the T-Tester itself.
  
  This version is NOT secret-laden, and it exists as a snapshot of classic Gmod map design, existing alongside icons like rp_downtown_v4c_v2, quite possibly the most famous DarkRP map ever made, which came out only five months before 67thway_v7. And, one of this map's best qualities, is the easter egg inclusion of a particular song left playing on the barn's radio, cementing it as a product of its time and demonstrating the love of Source-related gaming culture that went into it.
  
  As far as I'm concerned, this is a must-have map. But, if "classic" sounds more like "old" to our average player nowadays, then my next submission may be more to their tastes...
  
  [Recommended player count: 6-20]
• Screenshots attached
  Main Street, wide shot:
  https://i.imgur.com/nhd2AC2.png
  
  House and anti-car blockage:
  https://i.imgur.com/KaXV4xR.png
  
  Barn area, accessible:
  https://i.imgur.com/O22nHNg.png
  
  T-Tester with breakable control box:
  https://i.imgur.com/WUmxZB5.png

[Elfbarf]

Big fan of the addition of Thé à la Menthe to the radio, but this has some pretty big drawbacks compared to our usual v3.

 

The main one is the seemingly pointless removal of the cars - players like to dick around in traffic and it's always hilarious when someone is accidentally run over. Removing it takes away some very welcome fun and kinetic energy from the main area of the map. I could look past this if the additions were meaningful enough, but...

 

Everything else in the main area of the map is identical aside from the addition of a pretty annoying scanner t trap.

There's an addition of two small rooms with obvious traps...but they don't really have a purpose.

 

Downstairs changes - A button that lets you buy an additional knife every minute - yeah no, this is bad and reason enough to reject it.

Vent leading from the tester room out - this is an alright addition.

Other vents - ok, bit awkward and I feel like as an innocent you're just going to get killed in these given how long and straight they are.

[Mitchel256]

The removal of the cars, as mentioned, removes some semi-randomness in exchange for consistency, and I've found that to be a fair and welcome trade when I want to really enjoy a solid T round.

 

The two rooms with obvious traps are a different brand of random fun. Just someone experimenting with what they could do, I imagine, which is a mostly-irrelevant demonstration of the passion that went into 67thway's design. And, while the traps themselves have seen almost zero use in the many times I've played this map, that little hallway that connects them sees a ton. That door is an excellent place to hide, fall back, plant hidden C4, and mix up your approaches when trying to kill people coming from the underground or main street.

 

The vent leading out of the tester room comes with the drawback of having to destroy the T-Tester, which I've often seen accompanied with a KoS rule before. "If you destroy the Tester, KoS.", but with the sole exception of: "If the T uses the water trap and plants a C4, then you can break the T-Tester without consequence." I think the walls were made thinner so that standing against the back wall wouldn't save you in this version, but I could be wrong. Also, "being a T in the tester room and claiming that there was C4 (that you may or may not have planted yourself) that you needed to break the tester to get away from" was a solid and scarcely-used strat.

 

The main benefit of the "other vents" was to give you a fallback from that hall with the table that the MAC-10 and HUGE are on. It works for that, but, yeah, you can get caught in it. There are a couple better uses I can think of for it, but I wouldn't want to give away all the tricks just for the sake of justifying the map being added.

 

Oh, man, I had actually completely forgotten about the scanners, but, hell, I'd argue that they're practically a replacement for the cars, as far as hilarity goes. It's a practically harmless T-Trap that's easily dealt with and costs nothing, but, every once in a while, you'll be in a fight - whether you're T or Inno, doesn't matter - and get flashed by a scanner while dead people laugh about it. Good times.

 

And, as far as the only real mark against the map, the knife dispenser, I agree that it can be egregious, but, with both the position that it's in (access to the underground T-Room can be difficult to negotiate, even with a new, second door) and it requiring a credit per use, it adds up. I don't remember that dispenser ever getting much use at all, and its actual purpose is even less-used.

 

So, ultimately, the criticism of this one is "no cars" and "knife dispenser", where everything else listed is inconsequential to the untrained eye, and therefore not worth being listed as a con. One of those criticisms is a concern about fun factor, which, y'know, it's 67thway. Fun leaks out of its crevices. The other is a balance concern, which, sure, but that's throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

[Elfbarf]

I'm not adding this on the knife dispenser alone - that is a killer for any map in my opinion. It has the potential to severely change the gamemode's intended balance, which we try to avoid as a mostly vanilla server. If we wanted traitors to be able to purchase multiple knives, it's a quick edit away.

 

I don't really see the point of the vent leaving the t tester room in either version you suggested - traitors can see into and enter the testing room and if they see you enter the vent, you're a sitting duck. It's not a very good escape route, and v3 instead forces the traitors to take a risk and go on the offense against trapped innocents in the tester room as time is always ticking.