Forum Utilization / Reformatting

[Spiritwind]

1 minute ago, Ejivis said:

Seems to me this post got off topic and turned into a "who should be in charge" debate.  Sorry, I thought this was about the forums and the discord content.  

 

Either way, if you stay the forums should go I simply cannot agree with that in the slightest.  Replacing the forums with a landing page to the discord is a really bad idea (as the reasons @Spiritwindsaid above).  Archiving the forums is also a bad idea unless you're completely giving up on them.  Again, by doing that you are also saying you are giving up on any influx of players from CS2 community servers anytime within the next year or two.  We've seen and heard many times that money is not an issue keeping things online, so with that being said, it makes absolutely zero sense to decommission for forums. 

 

The forums are a nostalgic place indeed, however, nostalgia won't save them.  The reason traffic is lacking is because we have more people leaving than joining.  People have lives and they will rotate their interests when it comes to communities.  New relationships, school, jobs, etc will cause this.  The focus should be on getting new members not bringing old members back.  Old members will come back on their own when their life is ready.  It's the current active members and leaders job to ensure they have a place to come back to. 

 

If we want new members to join then we have to actively go out and recruit them.  You will also need more than 2 permanent servers for them to play on.  Again, this should be fixed once Valve get their stuff together with CS2 and community modders make leaps with plugins.  We cannot do anything about that right now.  Every community is suffering.  The only alternative is to find new games to host dedicated servers for in the meantime.  

 

Again, the biggest reason the forums are in decline is because there arent people playing on community servers.  Who exactly is supposed to join the forums these days?  Who is supposed to come and happen upon this place as a new member on the internet? 

 

The discord has new members join often because they find the server via discovery randomly.  That and thinking we are a "Steam" group for Steam related questions and stuff.

I really dislike the idea of condensing the discord channels.  What does that achieve?  The issue isn't that we have "too many" channels.  The issue is that we have "too many unused" channels.  We need simplify the discord by removing the bloat and unused channels and then diversify.  it is a 2 step approach.  There are many thing missing from the discord that would help the community and drive organized discussion.  I don't want 1 or 2 text channels that clutter with a smorgasbord of random things.  We already do that with random.  As I said before, random should be split up to have many more organized topic discussions.  The politics and food channels are a good representation of this.  

 

 

It turned into a who should be incharge debate as soon as removing the forums at all was even suggested.  

 

But, you are correct and make a lot of very good points in your post.  

[Greggy G]

4 minutes ago, Ejivis said:

 Sorry, I thought this was about the forums and the discord content.  

Its ok, dont do it again lil bro

[Phoenix_]

  

37 minutes ago, Dominic said:

 

I have too much pride in not being a hypocrite to consciously be one, I'm more than willing to have that conversation - just not gonna respect it coming from an alt account as much as I would someone like yourself. I'm pretty sure you've read the post in the CA section where I legitimately called for Caution and Gator to both resign, which ended up happening not too long after. I'd say things went pretty well from there when Revenga and I ran things while being super active, definitely better than when the people at the top were inactive. This is why in recent months I've posted a few times (one time in that public BD chat I think) about being willing to resign if Caution called for it. I realize my mistake here was that Caution is also inactive currently, so I should've put that offer out to the Board.

 

I've considered it a couple times now, but I just don't think we're in the right spot for me to leave the guys in power directionless. If they themselves call for it, then I'd be more willing for sure. Unless someone has a proposed power structure that makes sense, anyway.

 

I refuse to compromise on someone logging on a VPN and shit talking my 'intelligence and emotional maturity' - nor will I somehow convince myself it has something to do with me that staff feel like they need to hide behind a VPN. I have been open and willing to talk about the hard topics for as long as I can remember. I can be a condescending person sometimes for sure but I'm not about to pawn off some asshole comment as some type of reason for self reflection. Not happening. Anyone who knows me even slightly well knows very well that I'm always an open ear for even the most blunt types of criticism, and I simply won't let anyone convince me otherwise. I've been that way for years now. So if anyone feels as that alt account feels, you can absolutely Discord DM me.

 

Just as you can talk to me as someone that was on the Board, I can talk to you as someone who was also retired at one point. I'm sure you understand it's easy enough to say all the 'things that need change' but not so easy to actually propose what change should happen. Especially because we are so not at the point where 'there's always someone that wants / is able to take your spot' is applicable anymore.

 

Granted I wasn't involved super heavy in community discussion while Revenga was President, I was just a half-inactive TA, but even when I read through the channels, it really didn't feel like much even happened or was ever actually executed. So it seems like the activity fell under the category of "cool, yeah! ideas!" but nothing was ever done. 

 

I would say now is the pretty much last chance you have to walk away. You wouldn't be leaving those in power directionless, you would be giving them an opportunity to let them execute direction. @Zero Twoand @Karmaaren't people I've spoken a ton to, but when I have they actually seemed willing to get invovled and drive ideas forward and be active and mingle with the community base they lead. You would open the door to people those two mingle with to get them in a position to execute change and maybe use the last chance to bring some semblance of life in this community. 

 

It is pretty easy to propose what change should happen (imo), and here's the last idea I'll throw at this place in this thread:

 

• Further simplify the staff structure. No president, no supreme leader, just make kind of like an "executive council type shit". They would functionally be a board and work together, but they would properly have their tasks delegated to them to provide DIRECTION. Overall, just simplify and reduce the staff we have to people that want to be here so we don't have an inflated amount of staff that straight up don't look the community.  How, you may ask is this achievable? Something like this:
  • 7 "board members", two for each type of position, and one special position
    • 2 Technical leads, in charge of all technical aspects (discord upkeep, server technical issues, etc) - Nishok and Boto. Current tech team members would just remain as "Technical Staff"
    • 2 Server Leads, in charge of managing what few servers we have, making sure changes get pushed, events happen, etc. - ZeroTwo and Karma. Current AOs would be there to assist in running specific servers. 
    • 2 Community Leads, in charge of making community events and finding ways to push community interaction and fostering a welcoming and fun environment - Find two people for this (will explain below)
    • 1 Financial Manager, a hands off person who just makes sure the money is straight and that's their only job. - Caution, so yall didn't have to play switching accounts and whatever. He could stick around just making sure the money is right.
  • All current Server administrators could be asked if they want to retain their staff role. If so, allow them to be a discord moderator and admin for the few servers we still have
• Literally make a post on Discord announcements and be like "yo, we're looking for community leads to lead the community and blah blah blah (explained above)", make a google form and make some sort of vetting/interview process to find the best candidate. Would it be cool if it were someone already in the community? Yes. But, sometimes great ideas and innovation can come from an outside source. You're at a point where you need to make outreach and find ideas and inspiration from a stranger potentially. 

There's your (a proposed) solution. A change, activity, an attempt at pushing forward.

 

I know for the last point, it may be hard to trust someone less experience and thrusting them in a position of power, but it's worth a shot when (based on this thread), the community has lost its trust and faith in you, @Dominic

 

 

Also @Spiritwindcame through with an absolute bombshell while I was writing this, +1 to his post. 

[Ejivis]

2 minutes ago, Spiritwind said:

It turned into a who should be incharge debate as soon as removing the forums at all was even suggested.  

 

But, you are correct and make a lot of very good points in your post.  

Yes, removing the forums should've not been brought up because it sounds like someone contemplating giving up already.  Discord cannot be a good replacement for forums.  Discord threads are HORRENDOUS.

[Trazz]

28 minutes ago, Spiritwind said:

Dominic, my personal opinion, and take this any way you want:

 

A major reason as to why SG currently has 0 players in the servers, is on the brink of extinction, and has lost 99% of its dedicated members is left to the simple fact that you are even in this community, let alone a vice president.  

Hear me out; SG has become nothing but a popularity contest.  Pure and simple.  What you did 3 years ago should have resulted in permanent removal from the community.  Prior to Caution taking office, there would not have been a single chance for you to even make an appeal after the sort of behavior you displayed.  All staff attention has gone to exactly that; staff attention.  Decisions are no longer made on the idea of what will actually help the gaming community, the past and present members, but instead is based on what will make you feel better or look more flashy.    

 

The only reason you were unbanned, is that the remaining members of the community were narcissistic buddies who still included you in their circle, minus a few good souls who only stick around and help because of the nostalgia of the good ol' times when SG actually meant something and had core values and leadership.  

 

You can take this however you want.  But, I can say that I've talked it over with multiple people who have been long term members, and they felt the same way.  

 

If you are taking offence to this, just ask yourself one question.  If I did what you did 3 years ago; started another gaming community, tried to sour the SG reputation by telling people we were stealing money, went on the servers and kept spamming ip links, created multiple fake accounts to continue to harass the community, stole SG developed plugins, convinced multiple admins to follow me; and then continued to try and create drama between the two communities.  Would you let me back in?  Do you really think you would ever have been let back in if you had not been buddies with some of the higher ups and active members still?  

 

I don't think your a bad person dominic.  I think at heart you mean well and you've grown since then, but I don't think you should ever have been included again.  You may have changed, but you are still the same person.  You may say you have an open discussion, but its just a front.  Show you are open to what the community is saying not by words, but by action.  

 

You say that you don't think you should leave higher staff directionless, but SG has been directionless for years.  Look at where it is now.  This is what it has become under your direction.

 

EDIT:
Last but not least, if that gaming community you had made had ever been a success, do you really think you'd have ever took a second look at SG again?  Nope, but it failed, just like SG is under the current leadership.

+1 

[Hawks]

@Zero Twothoughts?

[Ejivis]

Not to discredit anyone's feelings and opinions, but quoting and replaying +1 is only cluttering discussion.  That is what likes are for.  It is just an example of immature and unhelpful behavior. 

[kabLe]

Just now, Ejivis said:

Not to discredit anyone's feelings and opinions, but quoting and replaying +1 is only cluttering discussion.  That is what likes are for.  It is just an example of immature and unhelpful behavior. 

Except it's coming from people who have all put more than their fair share of time and effort into the place.

[ThRza]

1 minute ago, Ejivis said:

Not to discredit anyone's feelings and opinions, but quoting and replaying +1 is only cluttering discussion.  That is what likes are for.  It is just an example of immature and unhelpful behavior. 

 

[Ejivis]

Just now, kabLe said:

Except it's coming from people who have all put more than their fair share of time and effort into the place.

Then I would suggest those persons write their feelings themselves from their own point of views and perspectives.