Equipping a weapon on nearby death (Minor Issue)

[IntenseFajita]

TL;DR if a friendly T player dies with a gun next to you, you shouldn't be killed for equipping their fallen gun while you are undeniably following orders (notably during the first seconds of a round, and especially while T gates are closed). Lmk if this has already been discussed, and please link the thread for my education. I couldn't initially find anything on this topic, so link it and close the thread if so, thx.

 

This is gonna be very controversial, and I see both sides of the issue - don't get me wrong. A gun is a gun, and CT's need to protect themselves to win the round. Both sides can have MILLISECONDS to react to individual situations. BUT, I do not believe a CT should be allowed to mow-down a crowd of T's just because somebody had a gun among a crowd. Equipping a gun is 100% instant, but the animation between equipping and firing the gun is reliant upon the individual gun's game-defined settings. Please review 3KliksPhilip's video on this topic:

. It can take about a maximum of 4-5 seconds to deploy an equipped weapon (Though most will only take

 

You can drop a weapon IMMEDIATELY after pick-up, BUT WHO TF HAS THAT KIND OF REACTION TIME? If you can manage to instantaneously react to an action that is counter-intuitive to normal CSGO behavior (i.e. picking up a local weapon drop, and dropping within the same second) - uninstall CSGO. You obviously need a break for a bit.

 

A player who had no immediate malicious intentions while following orders, especially while facing AWAY from CT's, can be killed because they were unknowingly lined up next to a player with a gun during an order.

 

Imagine an armed T dies next to you. I don't know about you, but I personally cannot whip around and headshot a CT player in 1.85 seconds flat while I have 2-3 seconds to even comprehend the fact that the guy next to me died, and I now have a gun, and I may have an opportunity to rebel. For sure, it's an obvious KOS, but the game limitations and our rules could turn off newer players if it is not acknowledged. Also, most players are probably not Global Elite pros with inhumane reactions.

 

It's a tough nut, for sure. CT's have an obligation to kill armed T's on sight. But, most people choose to play as CT's for the challenge. We emphasize that CT's should be experienced with JB. We scorn and educate CT's for their mistakes almost every round. They may or may not receive the feedback. But the current rules allow CT's to kill unaware T's just for existing in the same world space as a recently deceased armed T. It gives CT's permission to completely mow-down a crowd until the weapon has been located and isolated. Until then, who knows how many T's may be susceptible to a weapon's drop position.

 

This is completely situational and difficult to capture/enforce, but I thought it may be important to consider. I'm welcome to scrutiny and positions I may have not been aware of. It's been awhile since I've extensively played JB , and I'm aware that players aren't perfect and are unaware of animation times, and it might be difficult to enforce.

 

A CT obviously shouldn't have to literally count 1.85 seconds before they have permission to KOS. But, they should be warned about mowing down a crowd just because an armed T was among the crowd.

 

Lmk what you think, ily

[Gentoo]

This seems really unfair as a T, and most CTs will give the T a second or two to drop a primary, but here's why it shouldn't be changed: any delay, even 2 seconds, is more than enough time for a T to run into their cell or into a stack of Ts. A T with a primary ALWAYS has an advantage over the CTs. This may seem counterintuitive considering CTs have armor and a whole team with Primaries, however, CTs must check if the T has a primary, keep track of other Ts they aren't pursuing, and can't shoot into a crowd, even if there's a T with a primary unless they have a good chance of headshotting or otherwise killing the KOS T. Simply put, any T with a primary is an IMMEDIATE threat. If @Dominic wants to look into not KOSing a T that has dropped a primary or whatever, I'd be fine with that, but I feel it would do more harm than good with people complaining about not having enough time to drop it or being shot as they were dropping it. People get triggered about it every once in a while, but for the most part, Ts are fine with it and just consider it part of being a T.

[Tweedledee]

It’s frustrating when shit like that happens. Countless time I’ve seen a idiot CT walk into medic while all the T’s are in there and then *surprised pikachu face* he dies! If there were a rule that tried to prevent killing T’s on pickup of a gun it would be very hard to enforce. I understand your frustration because I’ve also seen countless time where all the T’s are lined up and a primary comes into the mix and then this wild, kill hungry CT taps each of their heads off. Thats not right, but I don’t see a way to fix that because that CT is technically in the right.

[fantastic]

A CT obviously shouldn't have to literally count 1.85 seconds before they have permission to KOS. But, they should be warned about mowing down a crowd just because an armed T was among the crowd.

 

From the JB rules thread:

"Crossfire is when a CT is trying to shoot a T that is not following an order/rebelling, and other Ts are shot/killed in the firefight. Most of the time it is not freekilling, but if a CT is clearly going out of his way to "crossfire" then he can be punished. But the vast majority of the time crossfire is simply that, an accident. CTs do not have to slay for crossfire, but if an admin deems they're abusing the rule to freekill or carelessly spraying people down they can act."

 

Spraying down a crowd of people where a single person has a primary holstered, to me, is abusing the rule to freekill. So no, a CT cannot mow down a crowd just because an armed (holstered) T was among the crowd.

 

Additionally, it is a T's job to stay away from their teammate who has a primary if they don't want to get killed. I could only see the rule being applied in situations where it's impossible (say someone has a primary in iso) to keep your distance from a teammate who has a primary. It seems difficult to implement a rule where CTs need to give X amount of time to throw away a primary picked up from a teammate. As long as the crossfire rule is enforced, I don't really see what kind of rule could be implemented.

[Demi]

It gets really irritating if a gun gets dropped into a T, the T immediately drops it, and gets gunned down 10-15 seconds later.

[GG EZ]

The jb team discussed this and we felt that there is no way of ruling this situation to where players will not abuse the rule or make it to where its clear cut and easy to follow.

 

If you have any suggestion about how we should change up or add another rule, please post it so that we can review it and see if we like it or not and possibly add it to the rules

[Legendary Kano]

The jb team discussed this and we felt that there is no way of ruling this situation to where players will not abuse the rule or make it to where its clear cut and easy to follow.

 

maybe we can do this and increase the time being t on jb for like a day to let new comers learn the rules( am i on another topic?)

or we can just order ts to unstack

[Gentoo]

The jb team discussed this and we felt that there is no way of ruling this situation to where players will not abuse the rule or make it to where its clear cut and easy to follow.

 

If you have any suggestion about how we should change up or add another rule, please post it so that we can review it and see if we like it or not and possibly add it to the rules

 

If a T drops a primary, they are no longer KOS. This does not revoke any KOS from them shooting at, damaging, or killing a CT. They are also still KOS while holding the primary. I understand that this could also still be abused if someone wanted to gun down To before they had a chance to drop it, or TS could always claim they were never holding a primary, but I think this is sort of the direction you guys may be looking for.

[duffy]

If a T dies next to you WHILE YOU'RE FOLLOWING THE ORDERS you should not be kos. You should at least be given some time to drop the gun before a CT can actually kill you. It is completely unfair is say, you're stacked up at the bottom of main cell stairs and you're following the orders and one of your teammates next to you die with a primary. You could A, take a warning shot by moving away and potentially die if there's a CT with a lack of knowledge of what's going on or B, take the primary and drop it immediately in hopes that there isn't a CT who is kill hungry. This gray area should definitely be focuses on and maybe invert the currently rule because in my opinion it is complete BS.

[delirium]

People complaining about how hard it is to play ct and now you want them to have to wait to see if someone's going to drop a gun? Counterproductive imo