Redefining which vents are KOS on Jailbreak

[Pred]

1. The spyvspy p250/mask is KOS bc you have to get onto a invisible ladder and those are KOS able. As you said above that area can make it hard for the CT's to keep track of you also making it KOS. On the other hand, this is very similar to the pool deagle is razor revamp in the little room on catwalk. Maybe the modding team can take out the invisible ladder and input a ladder which everyone can see.

 

2. The mlcastle cell vent thing should not be KOS because it doesn't do anything so why kill for it, whoever kills people for going through that is probably a kill whore.

[fantastic]

1. The spyvspy p250/mask is KOS bc you have to get onto a invisible ladder and those are KOS able. As you said above that area can make it hard for the CT's to keep track of you also making it KOS. On the other hand, this is very similar to the pool deagle is razor revamp in the little room on catwalk. Maybe the modding team can take out the invisible ladder and input a ladder which everyone can see.

 

2. The mlcastle cell vent thing should not be KOS because it doesn't do anything so why kill for it, whoever kills people for going through that is probably a kill whore.

 

Agree with your point #2, but you're mistaking which vent I'm talking about for point #1. There is a secret in cells where you spawn which gives you a smoke/mask behind a breakable vent wall which I feel should not be KOS'able and is what is being addressed by the suggested rule change in OP. The p250/mask is KOS as you stated because of the invisible ladder and should remain this way.

 

Pool deagle is not KOS because it's not a secret and you don't need to go through any KOS areas to get there.

 

Thoughts on the suggested rule change?

[Lokibelowkey]

Like on the ye old Undertale map the cells had a game that were a secret and they had to go out of there way to do it and it wasnt kos. I feel like it speaks to this discussion that the secret should be kos admin that not all secrets are kos.

[delirium]

All vents should be KOS. Breaking walls or grated fixtures within your cell to cell hop before rounds may not give much of an advantage but should still be considered a secret. Vents (regardless of their intended use) have always been KOS for the servers that I've played over the last decade. I think that re-examining this is pedantic and the rules should stay as is.

[DancingMoonLight]

I'm still a firm believer that they should all remain KOS, rebranding every nook and cranny on JB as either KOS or not KOS is way too much of a time-waster and unnecessary. Much like invisible objects (ladders and buttons) unless they're required to be used to pass to a next area of of the map, they should remain KOS. Becoming too specific with things like these will only cause trouble in the future

[Legendary Kano]

I personally think that any vent that leads to armory should be KOS

 

well heres the thing. Some vents when used, you lose track of a t and he might get behind you and kill you and mow your team down without knowing where he is. Making every vent great opportunity for ts to hide and wait for right time to kill you if Cts dont know how to act to it first.

Conclusion =make every vents kos

[fantastic]

We had a discussion in the shoutbox just now about this rule change as well, and there were some really good points brought up:

 

- delirium brought up that the Spy vs. Spy secret mentioned in OP is a secret and not a vent

 

I interpreted it as a vent leading to a secret, but regardless the area is still KOS according to our current ruleset of secrets and vents being KOS. If we still want to go down this road of changing the current rule so that secrets+vents in the grey area were to be not KOS, there would have to be a clause for secrets as well, further complicating things. Thus, I'll remove the Spy vs. Spy secret example from OP since it's a secret and the wall is not a "vent".

 

- delirium + eden + DML (above) brought up that instead of changing the rule, it should be KOS and at most CTs discretion. We shouldn't change the ruleset and instead just let the situation play out

 

I agree with this to some degree. I think that while it's a nice solution which requires no rule changes, it causes inconsistency which leads to a worse experience on JB because certain vents don't seem KOS (the Castle example) and leads to some CTs killing for it, and others not. One point I brought up is that if even normally kill-hungry CTs often choose not to kill or warning shot Ts over use of a "vent", something that is clearly KOS, doesn't this indicate something with the rule needs to be changed?

 

I'm still a firm believer that they should all remain KOS, rebranding every nook and cranny on JB as either KOS or not KOS is way too much of a time-waster and unnecessary. Much like invisible objects (ladders and buttons) unless they're required to be used to pass to a next area of of the map, they should remain KOS. Becoming too specific with things like these will only cause trouble in the future

 

Thinking back to why I made the thread, the main type of vent that I wanted to address was the one on Castle between cells, and vents like it. If there would be a way to address solely this vent such that other vents would not be affected that would be the ideal solution, but until then what you said is probably right. At this point I'll just wait for Dom's POV on it and see what he thinks. Thanks for your thoughts

[TheZZL]

To make a general statement here, they should all be kos. Where this whole thread started was with the Spy vs. spy in-cell secrets (or whatever you want to call them) whether they should be KOS or not. I think, like what DML and deli said, ALL vents/secrets of breaking textures of the map to get into somewhere new should be KOS. It would be very rare for a CT to see a T use these when they do use them (The first 10 seconds of the round), thus we should just keep it KOS to get rid of confusion.

[Bad Karma]

 

• ba_mlcastle_se: vent between cells
  This doesn't make sense because it offers no advantages other than letting you hop between cells before cell doors are open. It doesn't lead to any KOS area, and it doesn't make a CT's job harder to keep track of Ts. However, because it's technically a secret, some CTs have been killing Ts for using this.

 

 

I do not think I have played on this map that much or even know this location but my question is, does this vent that leads to another cell make it easier for T's to possibly get to another location outside of cells quicker? Like a location that has a weapon hidden in it, or maybe a secret to armory ect...?

[delirium]

I do not think I have played on this map that much or even know this location but my question is, does this vent that leads to another cell make it easier for T's to possibly get to another location outside of cells quicker? Like a location that has a weapon hidden in it, or maybe a secret to armory ect...?

 

Doesn't matter if you gain anything out of using them. The fact that you have to 'break' your cell to use them should be enough to qualify them as secrets or vents.