Gunplanting

[Dico |HM|]

Before I say this, I just want to say that I have no idea if this has been brought up before, I've just recently come to this conclusion after seeing it Time after Time for no apparent reason.

I feel like the rules on Gunplanting are very vague. Let me give an example, a T is killed for shooting a guard with an ak, the ak drops into the hands of another T, who is then killed immediately, which, seeing how that could happen, I feel it could start a chain of KOSes, which would seem like Freekilling or Gunplanting to A good amount of people, wouldn't seem like it to most other players, who would say that they still picked up the primary, voluntarily or involuntarily. If you were to ask how you were supposed to avoid getting killed, the response would be something like "don't pick it up" or "don't walk into it" or even, my favorite, "Unlucky, I guess, LMAO."

I feel a good way to fix this is to implement a time or something like "as soon as, or a second after they can drop it." Maybe something like a (highly modded and edited, but you can definitely figure it out) Clock plugin that appears in the bottom-center, or top right of the screen to tell you how long you've had the weapon. It would stay on the screen for 30 seconds after you die. It would only appear on T and wouldn't bee so big as to obscure your screen. That or it could only appear after you die.
I feel like, yes, this would also mean that tweaking the Secondary rules a bit, but I feel like the same rules would apply, as well as the current ones being mixed in, something like you can hold it out for 1.5x the amount that applies for Primaries, or "as soon as, or 1.5 seconds after they can drop it." As well as the "Not KOS if you can pocket it quick enough" thing. The Clock would also apply to this to help with times.

Now, I feel like all of this Overall would make people, especially the ones who I wont name, who like to find loopholes in the rules, (which lets face it, are a little outdated by now, considering how many loopholes you can find), would be upset with the new changes, but I feel like it would be worth it to make things a little more clear to new and old players, and overall fix the rules on Gunplanting and how to spot it.

Im open to critiques, so feel free

Thanks,

[Ero]

12 minutes ago, Dico |HM| said:

a T is killed for shooting a guard with an ak, the ak drops into the hands of another T, who is then killed immediately, which, seeing how that could happen, I feel it could start a chain of KOSes,

In this section is a good example of what happens often . This can create chaos on the servers yet no rules were breaking un less the ct who was killed  was bating or deliberately throwing the gun in to "gunplant" the t's . To quote the rules "Gunplanting - When a CT gives a T a gun" and unless this is happening its not gunplant though gunplanting and bating can be related like you bait the t's to gunplant a gun . I hope this cleared it up for you if not just @ me .

[Dico |HM|]

2 minutes ago, Ero said:

In this section is a good example of what happens often . This can create chaos on the servers yet no rules were breaking un less the ct who was killed  was bating or deliberately throwing the gun in to "gunplant" the t's . To quote the rules "Gunplanting - When a CT gives a T a gun" and unless this is happening its not gunplant though gunplanting and bating can be related like you bait the t's to gunplant a gun . I hope this cleared it up for you if not just @ me .

This cleared it up, but I feel like everything else still applies, its happened on multiple occasions, even earlier today, where there was a rebelling T in front of the rest of us, they were killed and the primary flew back, the ct killed a good chunk of us, and i feel like that could be avoided if something was changed.

[Autistic]

I understand the importance but in the end this only effects a round when it normally happens. In the end the CT who baited/gun planted is to blame and should be punished. I also don't see a way to make a rule for this cycle of killing, as it only takes half a sec if a t who gets the gun wants to rebel or not. It also doesn't help for most people who still have the setting of swap on pick up who get confused and domed by a ct instantly.

[The Real Slim Jim]

On 5/11/2021 at 11:56 AM, Dico |HM| said:

I feel like the rules on Gunplanting are very vague. Let me give an example, a T is killed for shooting a guard with an ak, the ak drops into the hands of another T, who is then killed immediately, which, seeing how that could happen, I feel it could start a chain of KOSes, which would seem like Freekilling or Gunplanting to A good amount of people, wouldn't seem like it to most other players, who would say that they still picked up the primary, voluntarily or involuntarily. If you were to ask how you were supposed to avoid getting killed, the response would be something like "don't pick it up" or "don't walk into it" or even, my favorite, "Unlucky, I guess, LMAO."

it happens, but not too much. Its a thing of morals, did the t drop it as soon as they could? yes? I should probably let them live. if people arent doing that you can always send them a suggestion that they could pardon next time, or suggest they relax a little and remember that everyone is trying to have fun. 

 

On 5/11/2021 at 12:37 PM, Vintage said:

 I would like to start out by saying that your suggestion is not all too bad but seems very unnecessary. From my experiences, it isn't all too common

This.

 

On 5/11/2021 at 12:15 PM, Ero said:

To quote the rules "Gunplanting - When a CT gives a T a gun" and unless this is happening its not gunplant though gunplanting and bating can be related like you bait the t's to gunplant a gun

to not quote the rules;

gunplanting can happen from a T or a CT.  A CT getting killed and dropping a gun to a separate T who isn't kos,  is still gunplanting if it didnt touch the ground. 

 

On 5/11/2021 at 11:56 AM, Dico |HM| said:

I feel a good way to fix this is to implement a time or something like "as soon as, or a second after they can drop it." Maybe something like a (highly modded and edited, but you can definitely figure it out) Clock plugin that appears in the bottom-center, or top right of the screen to tell you how long you've had the weapon. It would stay on the screen for 30 seconds after you die. It would only appear on T and wouldn't bee so big as to obscure your screen. That or it could only appear after you die.
I feel like, yes, this would also mean that tweaking the Secondary rules a bit, but I feel like the same rules would apply, as well as the current ones being mixed in, something like you can hold it out for 1.5x the amount that applies for Primaries, or "as soon as, or 1.5 seconds after they can drop it." As well as the "Not KOS if you can pocket it quick enough" thing. The Clock would also apply to this to help with times.


Im open to critiques, so feel free

the only way I can see an actual rule being made for this is something along the lines of primaries are KOS unless dropped into a stack. that way, if they are stacked CTs have to give an order to unstack, giving a chance to drop the primary to the whole stack before anyone can die.

 

BUT: this makes CTs an easy targets in this scenario.

[john jones]

23 minutes ago, The Real Slim Jim said:

it happens, but not too much. Its a thing of morals, did the t drop it as soon as they could? yes? I should probably let them live. if people arent doing that you can always send them a suggestion that they could pardon next time, or suggest they relax a little and remember that everyone is trying to have fun. 

 

This.

 

to not quote the rules;

gunplanting can happen from a T or a CT.  A CT getting killed and dropping a gun to a separate T who isn't kos,  is still gunplanting if it didnt touch the ground. 

 

the only way I can see an actual rule being made for this is something along the lines of primaries are KOS unless dropped into a stack. that way, if they are stacked CTs have to give an order to unstack, giving a chance to drop the primary to the whole stack before anyone can die.

 

BUT: this makes CTs an easy targets in this scenario.

I agree with slim on this I do feel like if a gun is in stack with a bunch of ts and the t gets killed that has the gun I feel that the t that picks up the gun from the t that has been killed should not be killed instantly especially if they drop it right away and then the ct kills them but like slim said the cts would be in more risk of being killed easily but I just think it would be more fair if in a stack you give maybe 3 seconds to let the t drop the gun that was picked up from a rebel or a t with a primary.

 

 

just a side note I’m on my phone right now so if smt don’t make sense that’s why sorry I’m advance 

[Shawty]

On 5/10/2021 at 7:56 PM, Dico |HM| said:

Now, I feel like all of this Overall would make people, especially the ones who I wont name, who like to find loopholes in the rules, (which lets face it, are a little outdated by now, considering how many loopholes you can find),

There are always players that will find loopholes in rules no matter what. You can't perfect a set of rules for the server; it's just not possible. However, if someone is repeatedly skirting rules its up to admins whether or not they punish for it. In this case, if an experienced CT was killing everyone that was 'gunplanted' in a stack, without giving the T's any time to drop it, you can call an admin and I'm sure they'll warn or punish the player.

 

TLDR - can't stop loopholes in rules, admins can punish those that find loopholes and abuse them

[Easterpink]

Hello, this topic has been brought up many times throughout the years. The fact of the matter is that it isn't possible for us to implement a plugin that bypasses auto-pickup for guns, since it is a client side convar. As for making a rule where Ts can drop the primary and not be KOS, we have decided not to do that because it would be difficult to moderate, conflicts with our current rules, and would give CTs a greater disadvantage. When a prisoner gunplants a fellow prisoner, it is considered teamkill, but we are usually lenient about it since its an accident most of the times. Thank you for being patient with your question.